Speed limit after crossing the negative space boundary

Discussion concerning other (non-RS) systems of theory and the insights obtained from them, as applied to the developing RS2 theory.
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Coder
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Speed limit after crossing the negative space boundary

Post by Coder »

Doesn't that 137 seem like the interregional ratio effect? See:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&featu ... ZBuhall5hA
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bperet
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137

Post by bperet »

They are discussing a photon being captured by an electron, changing its energy level, saying that the photon, traveling at c, slows down to 1/137 of c when it encounters the electron. The stuff with the electron changing energy levels is not relevant, because the capture changes the net speed of the electron, which changes its orbital velocity.

In the RS, the IRR for an electron is 128(1+1/9) = 142.

The range of photons between infrared and ultraviolet are spatially-displaced, just like the electron, so there should not be a region crossing upon their interaction. Space is adding to space, giving more space. (Consider it must be this situation, as if the photon were time-displaced, the relation of space to time constitutes motion, and the photon would pass through the electron, never being captured.)

You can still get the basic idea from the IRR formula. The 128 is the total degrees of freedom. The DOF determines how much a speed is "rotationally distributed" (as Larson puts it), so if you were to measure it, you only see 1/DOF of the original speed, no matter where you measure.

So the electron has already slowed to 1/128c because it has been captured by an atom. A photon has 9 DOF but does not slow because it is being carried by the progression at the speed of light. When the photon is captured by the electron, there is a measured drop in speed of that of the electron DOF + the photon DOF, 128 + 9 = 137. That is probably where the number is coming from.

There is one curiosity about this. Since both are space-displaced motions and time remains constant, the speed measured should be 1/137 FASTER than the speed of light, not slower (more space in the same amount of time). I bet that they are measuring speed as a displacement from the speed of light to get the 1/137, but have not considered the direction of that shift, assuming it must be slower to match conventional theory.
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Coder
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137x

Post by Coder »

Since both are space-displaced motions and time remains constant, the speed measured should be 1/137 FASTER than the speed of light, not slower (more space in the same amount of time).
This exactly what the Podkletnov people are saying. The speed of their interaction is 137x FTL, not slower. You must have misheard it on that video.

BTW: The 1/DOF of the original speed is a very neat concept in general.
Ardavarz
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Fine structure constant and Kozyrev's "course of time"

Post by Ardavarz »

Interesting - this can be an alternative explanation of the value of the fine structure constant.

Curiously in his "asymmetric causal mechanics" the Russian astronomer Nikolay Kozyrev also proposed the existence of such physical quantity called "course of time" which distinguishes cause from effect in mechanical interactions. It is represented as pseudo-scalar quantity defined by the ratio of the very small, but non-zero spatial and temporal intervals between the points of cause and effect (i.e. assuming that mechanical interaction is not instantaneous in contrast to the notions of Newtonian mechanics) and so it has dimension of velocity. Kozyrev's experiments have shown it to have a value of about 1/137 from the speed of light and he correlates this with the fine structure constant. The pseudo-scalar quantity of the "course of time" is interpreted as linear velocity of rotation in a plane perpendicular to the axis between the points of cause and effect and this seems to me very similar to the notion about the "time region" in RS2.
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bperet
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Fine structure

Post by bperet »

Interesting - this can be an alternative explanation of the value of the fine structure constant.
Many of the constants in physics are not needed in the RS because they only exist to "fill in the blanks" when they don't know how something actually works, like the force of gravity (hence the strange dimensions on the gravitational constant).

It probably is the origin of the fine structure constant, but there are also other values--137 only applies to single, double-rotating systems (particles), not atoms, which is the 156.4444 number: 128 (*1 + 2/9) to account for the "two" photon rotations. (I have been questioning Larson's double-double rotating system, as it seems a solid rotation makes more sense than two, single rotations.)
Every dogma has its day...
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